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 The Ultimate Network / Router Thread

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pariah_81



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PostSubject: Re: The Ultimate Network / Router Thread   Wed Apr 18, 2012 3:51 pm

audiopile wrote:
pokerchipped wrote:

Hey this got me thinking....

Since Ping (ICMP) isn't how the game actually runs, could people on a fast connection get an advantage by purposely delaying ping replies (ie. add 100ms just to Ping ICMP) so lag comp thinks you're slow when you're actually not?

EDIT: I walked over and asked one of the network engineers here if this was possible. He thought I was crazy and couldn't see why anyone would ever do this (he's not a gamer) but couldn't rule out it's possibility and is going to look into it in his spare time.
This is what I'm getting at. I did a quick search on the internet and everyone wants to lower ping, not increase it.

audiopile wrote:
Thank you I would like to have a 500 ping during the lobby and then go back the to normal 75-100 I normally have with the COD servers. How do I do that?

What you are looking into is lag switching, and considered cheating. i know that some folks have been banned from xbl for doing this, and we on xbox side do report people that are blatantly using this.
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TydenWolf

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PostSubject: Re: The Ultimate Network / Router Thread   Wed Apr 18, 2012 3:56 pm

I just upgraded my internet this week thinking that I would have an easier time with everything that is going on. I have a cable ISP and went from 20MB down and 2MB up to 30MB down and 5MB up only a 10 dollar difference in price so I said what the hell. I all reality I don't see that much of a difference. I have two routers now since the cable company provided a cable modem/router combo unit and I have a higher end router that is already set up with my network. Here are my results :


that's 300 miles away but here is one that is closer:


Not sure why the further one is better but I bet you someone here will tell me.

here is the closer one:

and now the further one:



My Cable modem router combo is a : Ubee DDW3611 and the router I have also hooked up to it is: Asus RT-N56U.

My main complaint is that I have lag spikes either when gaming or watching netflix. I get more pissed off about the crap with netflix since gaming its usually not too bad but DAMN it sucks when you are in the middle of a movie or tv show and you get hit with a loading screen that takes 2-5 minutes to go away. Any help would be appreciated, thanks in advance.

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TydenWolf

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PostSubject: Re: The Ultimate Network / Router Thread   Wed Apr 18, 2012 3:57 pm

Pariah is right that is lag switching and it's cheating so please don't do it.

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PostSubject: Re: The Ultimate Network / Router Thread   Wed Apr 18, 2012 4:11 pm

TydenWolf wrote:
Pariah is right that is lag switching and it's cheating so please don't do it.

Cut the blue wire!!!!! I'm not about to add a switch to my controller or some goofy thing like that. Urgh. I will now hold my tongue.
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PostSubject: Re: The Ultimate Network / Router Thread   Wed Apr 18, 2012 5:33 pm

Sorry don't mean to offend it's a very big issue and problem there are places on the internet that sell the crap that you need to do this. Some of them even promise that you can't get caught doing it and stand behind it. I don't do it I don't cheat hell I hate people that boost to get their levels up and other crap like that.

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PostSubject: Re: The Ultimate Network / Router Thread   Wed Apr 18, 2012 6:48 pm

No offence taken, sorry to derail this tread with my whinings. Anyway, I watched the 27 minute video in the Matchmaking Changes thread and their definition of lag comp etc is far different than what is proclaimed in this thread. Either way, it is what it is and a good ping is where it's at. Thanks for your time and patience everyone.
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pariah_81

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PostSubject: Re: The Ultimate Network / Router Thread   Wed Apr 18, 2012 8:29 pm

BlackDeath wrote:
That would make sense (it only effecting host) since I feel the people complaining the most about lag comp have stellar connections.

So what you want to do audiopile is prevent pulling host. Earlier Pariah mentioned disabling UPnP would prevent pulling host - Pariah can you elaborate how? Isn't host designated purely by ping prior to game start?

Pulling host requires you have all of your available ports opened. UpNP (Universal Plug and Play) allows random ports to be accessed on a need to be used basis. Without that the servers will read that you do not have all your ports opened. It essentially tricks the server into not letting you pull host.

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BlackDeath

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PostSubject: Re: The Ultimate Network / Router Thread   Thu Apr 19, 2012 11:58 am

@audiopile

connection would vary between matches because the host is constantly getting lag comp re-applied based on lobby pings nothing is static - even if you have all the same lobby members you still have no idea who's doing what with their connections. Also host is always re-determined after every round (currently). If someone in the lobby suddenly starts livestreaming that'll increase their latency thus affecting lag comp overall.

If you're talking about the video from Capp00 - He claims dedicated servers won't resolve anything. Then why does any game that uses them play better than MW3? Smile I'll get back to you after I watch his new 30 mins diatribe.

I think I've been saying the same thing capp has been? The only thing I didn't know for sure was if lag comp w as based per person or per party and capp's recent video seems to say it was per party currently. I did say lag comp added latency but instead it essentially tries to guess where slower players are. I edited my orig reply relating to this.

@mwhop78

those results are stellar - I wouldn't change anything unless you're having NAT issues (not shown as open). This would definietely be a case of if its not broken dont fix it. You would have been given an "A" easily if it werent for the inability to test dropped packets. Sometimes that portion doesn't work properly (buggy) or maybe its your nat type or just a browser issue. I wouldn't worry about it. You will see varying results based on the host you're testing from. Also I've heard tests that use flash (like speedtest.net) are not very accurate. Testmy.net soley relies on the browser to transfer / test.

@pariah

thx for the explanation - I never realized that

@all

keep in mind I'm not trying to beat lag comp this threads intentions was to help educate how networks and routers work and if there were some serious issues you may be having then try and iron them out.

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PostSubject: Re: The Ultimate Network / Router Thread   Fri Apr 20, 2012 10:13 am

Just wanted to drop in and say a big thanks to ya BD...I'll get with ya on the traffic control and shaping, but I'll stick with Leavin everything like it is until we talk ...and on ur advive will keep it to just that Traffic shaping only improvment I need..lol thanks again bro
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TydenWolf

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PostSubject: Re: The Ultimate Network / Router Thread   Fri Apr 20, 2012 11:53 am

Hey Death got anything on my situation I am not trying to get better ping but a more stable connection. I have everything hardwired that I want a more stable connection to since I know that a hard wired connection is more stable than a wireless one. It seems that I suffer from some sort of lag spikes. When I am in game and I am in a live party and a lag spike hits I can see it on my screen now and it usually kicks me from the live party. I had a hell of a run on Call of the Dead last night with a friend of mine and we almost blew it because of the lag spike that I had I was in a party chat with him and a lag spike hit and I got kicked and we couldn't talk to each other and I had to wait until the end of the round to get back into the party.

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BlackDeath

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PostSubject: Re: The Ultimate Network / Router Thread   Fri Apr 20, 2012 12:27 pm

@Tyden I have the exact same problem from time to time. I've been kicked from XBL parties, I've seen it kick everyone else out of the party, I've also had it kick the whole mw3 party from a game Sad

In my case I'm at the mercy of my ISP. 3G Sprint is the only service provider available where I live other than satellite. So you can imagine being at the mercy of a WIRELESS ISP the frustrations I face.

There are a few things this could be. Firstly have you always had this problem or did it suddenly arise?

Have you introduced ANY new devices to your network (wired or wireless) this includes smartphones, tablets, PCs, eReaders, wireless mice, headphones, hell did you buy a new microwave? New / different router or ISP modem?

With your scenario its either internal (home network) or external (your ISP). An extremely easy way to test this is simply unplug every other device from the network with exception to your console. Play a few times / nights and see if the issue continues or resolves.

Let me know your results and we can continue from there.

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PostSubject: Re: The Ultimate Network / Router Thread   Fri Apr 20, 2012 12:33 pm

Ok I will do however that is going to take some time since I have to wait for a night that my wife is at work I can't tell her that she can't get online while I am playing a night's worth of xbox. As for the changes. I just upgraded my service from 20 down / 2 up to 30 down /5 up

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DELTAxDOG

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PostSubject: Re: The Ultimate Network / Router Thread   Fri Apr 20, 2012 12:39 pm

BlackDeath wrote:
@ Delta

lmfao - I can't believe you typed all that on your phone.

1mb up isnt terrible - keep in mind I'm dealing with HALF that! Run the tests from the sites I listed in my 2nd post in this thread and post the results here please. Also is your xbox hard wired or is it running wireless? What is COD reporting you NAT type as currently?

I should hopefully be online tonight btw.

I forgot to tell you my NAT is open. I still havent ran a test because i dont knoe what device to use to test it? My xbox is the only thing i have hard wired so would i need to connect my laptop to get a good test? I know that it doesent test well with wifi and my old PC that i just got rid of tested with the numbers i posted before from speed test.net

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Maverick9227

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PostSubject: Re: The Ultimate Network / Router Thread   Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:12 pm

Yea you need to connect a PC directly to it in order for a good test

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DELTAxDOG

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PostSubject: Re: The Ultimate Network / Router Thread   Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:16 pm

Maverick9227 wrote:
Yea you need to connect a PC directly to it in order for a good test

Thanks Maverick! I just gave you another reach-a-round because of it lol

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BlackDeath

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PostSubject: Re: The Ultimate Network / Router Thread   Fri Apr 20, 2012 2:58 pm

@tyden the problem started after upgrading service? When you upgraded did they give you a new cable modem / router? Did anyone visit the premises?

Also have you noticed it doing this at any particular time of day or do you generally see it happen anytime you're playing?

@delta yah bro you need to test it from a PC. Just plug your laptop in directly to the router and turn off wifi real quick (on the laptop) to test. Test from the sites I listed in my 2nd post. Re-test two or three times to get an average. Have you been experiencing anything in particular lately other than k/d envy / withdrawal? lol

I can't believe I JUST NOW noticed the reach around thing LMFAO.

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PostSubject: Re: The Ultimate Network / Router Thread   Fri Apr 20, 2012 3:03 pm

Yea i have this burning sensation when i pee.

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PostSubject: Re: The Ultimate Network / Router Thread   Fri Apr 20, 2012 3:04 pm

And i just gave you a reach-a-round so you may have it too!

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PostSubject: Re: The Ultimate Network / Router Thread   Fri Apr 20, 2012 4:08 pm

Here are my test from the first site... i did 6 test and the other 3 were like the last one, i dont understand what the fuck is up with that? It even told me something is rong on the site lol shit i didnt post the crappy one lol it was 7.09 down!






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PostSubject: Re: The Ultimate Network / Router Thread   Fri Apr 20, 2012 4:10 pm

I think they fucked up the MW3 servers somehow because I never changed anything and lately my NAT went from Open to Strict. I'm getting consistent 1.3 up and 304 down on my 1.5/384 connection so I don't think it's a connection issue yet the lagging and hit markers are really fucked lately. Seems like this since the last MW3 update they fucked something up.

Last night I checked the port forwarding for MW3 and it went from strict back to open after the PS3 lockup everyone had in the game. When I rebooted it went to open somehow. Now it's back to strict. Any suggestions as to why? I even tried putting my PS3 in the DMZ but it's still strict. I think it's on their end not mine? My UPNP is also enabled btw.
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PostSubject: Re: The Ultimate Network / Router Thread   Fri Apr 20, 2012 4:32 pm

so i guess my connetion just sucks!









Or not lol i dont get why these bad test keep showing up... im gonna do a speedtest.net one and see what it says.









Does any of this makes sense to anyone?

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PostSubject: Re: The Ultimate Network / Router Thread   Fri Apr 20, 2012 8:59 pm

@wzrd - who's your ISP? I'm guessing by the package details its DSL?

Like I said before I'm stuck with a 3G wireless ISP (Sprint) I have done some testing with Verizon. Regardless if my xbox was in a DMZ or not while on Sprint I'd show as OPEN NAT type. However when I switched to Verizon briefly it was moderate and I had to move my xbox into a DMZ. For the brief time I had DSL (which wouldn't stay up for longer than 10 mins) via Frontier I also was shown as moderate and had to move into the DMZ.

I think your ISP may be screwing with you. Especially if you have AT&T they are NOTORIOUS for blocking ports unexpectantly on their networks.

I hate to give this bland advice but have you tried unplugging your DSL modem for 60 seconds and reconnecting? If by chance you do have AT&T I'm guessing they gave you a 2wire brand modem. It should have some logging features - if you're comfortable viewing the config webpage of your modem / router you may be able to find a log section to get a better idea whats going on. If you see a lot of entries that mention "RETRY" or "DISCONNECT" it may be an issue with your ISP. Also there should be network statistics located somewhere in the modem menu / webpage - look for the number of dropped packets. If your modem/router also has wifi they're may be two different numbers listed...one set for wifi the other set for your actual ISP / WAN link. Make note of both.

@ delta thoseg results look good with exception of dropping packets in the one test. Depending on frequent that happens you'll experience spikes of lag while playing. Try running tests from servers on the west coast though vs one's right near you. You may be seeing a big discrepancy between upload numbers on different sites because a flash test can be fooled with some ISP's bandwidth "boost". Which basically just temporarily allows you more bandwidth before they start throttling you. Don't sweat that the download numbers vary - they're going to based on where you're testing from, the network load of your ISP currently, and any traffic shaping they're applying to you. With numbers like that I'd expect the game to play great - again unless you're ISP is dropping packets often. There isn't much you can do about that. Like I mentioned to wzrd you can check the log within your router - it should hold network statistics especially how many packets its dropping. If its excessive (like 100's in the matter of a few days) then I'd keep hounding your ISP. I'll be on in a little bit maybe we can actually get in a party this time before you take your Geritol and head to bed.

for sng here is what I'm putting up with



This is a good day


Note my username on testmy.net LOL

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PostSubject: Re: The Ultimate Network / Router Thread   Fri Apr 20, 2012 9:08 pm

Ok...new issue...all of a sudden not happened before...now when my phone rings I get lag the longer it takes to answer it it boots me out of the lobby????? WTF....and should I make the Phone company give me a completely seprate line in just for it instead of a spliter in the box?
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PostSubject: Re: The Ultimate Network / Router Thread   Fri Apr 20, 2012 9:10 pm

@reaper that totally sounds like a DSL filter problem

I'd call them and exaggerate slightly and say every time the phone rings you get disconnected from the Internet entirely. They should send someone out and replace the filter. If you can convince them to run a dedicated line / pair for DSL go for it! Otherwise they'll just come out and probably replace the filter. Hell Frontier will just mail you the filter and expect you to install it LOL.

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PostSubject: Re: The Ultimate Network / Router Thread   Sat Apr 21, 2012 8:42 pm

I think that I may have fixed the problem it is not happening as much as it did it's usually only on netflix and every now and again while playing but I did get new equipment I am in the process of having a friend that knows a crap more than I do about networking and the such to come over. I think I may have fixed the issue somewhat last night due to that I was moderate NAT and that should not be since I have a high end router that and I did not have any issues prior to the change now I realized that the new equipment was set up for default and the Upnp was not enabled on the new equipment once I did that I was set last night but my buddy will get me up and running more efficiently.

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PostSubject: Re: The Ultimate Network / Router Thread   Sat Apr 21, 2012 9:44 pm

I'm curious as to what you think of this guys vid, BlackDeath; and if it's worth the trouble. It's about assigning a static IP and Port Forwarding.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5bwm0GeoPXQ&feature=related



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